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by **mg_** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 10:03 am

The Case for Faith is fucking terrible.

by **showtime** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:55 am

Amazon.com Review
Award-winning reporter and author Lee Strobel (The Case for Christ) once again uses his investigative skills to address the primary objections to Christianity. As a former atheist, Strobel understands the rational resistance to faith. He even names the eight most convincing arguments against Christian faith:

1) If there's a loving God, why does this pain-wracked world groan under so much suffering and evil?
2) If the miracles of God contradict science, then how can any rational person believe that they're true?
3) If God is morally pure, how can he sanction the slaughter of innocent children as the Old Testament says he did?
4) If God cares about the people he created, how could he consign so many of them to an eternity of torture in hell just because they didn't believe the right things about him?
5) If Jesus is the only way to heaven, then what about the millions of people who have never heard of him?
6) If God really created the universe, why does the evidence of science compel so many to conclude that the unguided process of evolution accounts for life?
7) If God is the ultimate overseer of the church, why has it been rife with hypocrisy and brutality throughout the ages?
8) If I'm still plagued by doubts, then is it still possible to be a Christian?

These are mighty tough questions, and Strobel fields them well. Rather than write a weighty dissertation about the merits of faith, he brings us along on his quest as we meet leaders in the Christian community, such as Peter Kreeft and William Lane Craig. We also encounter his everyday friends and acquaintances that serendipitously fill in the holes in each of the eight arguments against faith. The use of dialogue from personal interviews and a scene-by-scene active narrative makes this an easy and engaging read. However, easy does not mean breezy. This is a book of substance and merit, one that will help Christians defend their faith, especially during the hardest of times, when they have to defend their faith to themselves in moments of doubt. --Gail Hudson

An older book but still good. Im sure some people here have read it before.

by **CharlieGiteau** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:11 am

Read this a while ago, but it was quite interesting.

by **bonerhaus** » Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:07 am

I read part of ZAMM, but didn't understand it... Philosophy isn't my thing.

These are my 2 that i'm reading.

by **stile** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 1:28 pm

if you guys like fantasy http://www.amazon.com/Taming-Fire-Drago ... 461&sr=8-3

yep. i like reading books about dragons.

But to make myself seem smart.. i am also reading:http://www.amazon.com/Terrorism-Counter ... 518&sr=1-2

by **mg_** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 11:42 am

I'm not sure, and this is where my personal view kind of destabilizes, which coincidentally where Derrida and a lot of the post-moderns lose traction. It is infinitely regressive, and I'm not sure I go that far with it. I do believe we have an objective existence. But, like Foucault said, "this is not a pipe" and we have a lot built up into that.

I like Foucault more because he wasn't so much against it (I do think Derrida is unfairly characterized as using as a sword against everything rather than a tool for analysis), but we just need awareness. Madness & Civilization which is more of a diagnosis and something Foucault later distanced himself from does a good job underscoring a desire to find what our institutions are doing and how they derive power. Foucault wasn't per se against power. He was against systemic abuses of power, and sought to find the root to drive it out.

It's not that we wouldn't exist or we wouldn't have physical functions, but it wouldn't be the same until we've applied our meanings to it.

by **kirk** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 9:12 am

mg_ wrote:I don't believe in objective existence. So, we're all here, but meaning is definitely applied, and how that meaning is applied should be explored. Speaking of which, I should re-read On Grammatology.

Reality has far more to do with our preconceived notions than we're comfortable admitting to.

What about empirical meaning? If people say we're here to reproduce and pass on our genetic material as intended by nature, would you disagree or agree?

by **mg_** » Sun Jan 29, 2012 6:44 am

I don't believe in objective existence. So, we're all here, but meaning is definitely applied, and how that meaning is applied should be explored. Speaking of which, I should re-read On Grammatology.

Reality has far more to do with our preconceived notions than we're comfortable admitting to.

by **kirk** » Sat Jan 28, 2012 10:13 pm

mg_ wrote:Zen is okay. I ready it a while ago. I just don't buy it.

It's a slipshod argument that ultimately underscores all metaphysical explanations of our world, and, ultimately what makes them all the same. Just not impressed, but it probably explains why I'm a nihilist to the nth degree and wish Derrida and Foucault had been my 2 gay dads.

I like deconstructionism when applied to literature/art. Derrida's work is interesting, but I don't subscribe to it for everything.

How far do you take your nihilism? No objective truths, morality, meaning, etc.?

by **mg_** » Sat Jan 28, 2012 5:35 pm

Zen is okay. I ready it a while ago. I just don't buy it.

It's a slipshod argument that ultimately underscores all metaphysical explanations of our world, and, ultimately what makes them all the same. Just not impressed, but it probably explains why I'm a nihilist to the nth degree and wish Derrida and Foucault had been my 2 gay dads.

by **kirk** » Sat Jan 28, 2012 9:56 am

mg_ wrote:Truth outside of empiricism is the intellectual way of saying I don't have a good argument.

This is where I branch off from Western philosophy and its adoration of rationality and merge to Eastern philosophy and its adoration of quality and goodness. There is an inexplicable nature to the truths behind Eastern philosophy.

Should read the book I first listed in the OP - ZAMM.

by **mg_** » Sat Jan 28, 2012 7:32 am

Truth outside of empiricism is the intellectual way of saying I don't have a good argument.

by **Swiss** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:48 pm

alex kirk wrote:
Swiss wrote:funny you said that, my favorite professor to date taught a chirstian philosophy course.
This guy was a major Christian, but on the opposite end of the spectrum as when people typically think of Bible-thumpers. I seriously think he was a Communist-hippie (definitely hippie, and definitely socialist in many matters). He's written a few books on the Christian moral imperative regarding the protection of the environment. Introduced me to Barbara Kingsolver. Knows everything about everything from mathematics to linguistics to religion to physics to philosophy. It'd be tough for people to not get along with him regardless of your beliefs/non-beliefs: he was all-accepting.

Beyond book smarts, though, the guy was just wise. Those are the brains that attract me. The kind of people who can kind of see through the mass amounts of shit in life/society and nab the truth between the lines. They have a deeper and more fundamental understanding of the world and humanity as a whole. They aren't constrained by rational and empirical thought, they acknowledge that empiricism doesn't provide all the answers. Truly a genius in my mind.

he was a christian as well but conservative while interestingly enough coming to similar conclusions. hes also written one of the key textbooks on reason that they use around the nation. awesome seeing the christian stereotype broken. it seems he covered the same topics as your prof (we talked about a ton of physics, reason...etc) while coming to the conclusion that so many other philosophers want to avoid. its not just that they "cannot" know the truth (in a relativistic way), but that truth there is truth that should be found through other methods outside of "empiricism." talked a lot about thomas aquinas who was remarkably forward looking

by **kirk** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 6:18 pm

Swiss wrote:funny you said that, my favorite professor to date taught a chirstian philosophy course.

This guy was a major Christian, but on the opposite end of the spectrum as when people typically think of Bible-thumpers. I seriously think he was a Communist-hippie (definitely hippie, and definitely socialist in many matters). He's written a few books on the Christian moral imperative regarding the protection of the environment. Introduced me to Barbara Kingsolver. Knows everything about everything from mathematics to linguistics to religion to physics to philosophy. It'd be tough for people to not get along with him regardless of your beliefs/non-beliefs: he was all-accepting.

Beyond book smarts, though, the guy was just wise. Those are the brains that attract me. The kind of people who can kind of see through the mass amounts of shit in life/society and nab the truth between the lines. They have a deeper and more fundamental understanding of the world and humanity as a whole. They aren't constrained by rational and empirical thought, they acknowledge that empiricism doesn't provide all the answers. Truly a genius in my mind.

by **Swiss** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 5:03 pm

alex kirk wrote:I had a professor who is probably one of the most thought-provoking and interesting people I will ever come across in my life. He taught theology and philosophy. Unbelievable man. Just the kind of people who I gravitate towards when trying to enlighten myself.

funny you said that, my favorite professor to date taught a chirstian philosophy course.

by **kirk** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 2:42 pm

Rob wrote:Just put your head out the window and shout "Looking for a guest lecturer!"

Cornel West will show up at your front door in 10 minutes, guaranteed. He's more ubiquitous on the lecture/talk show circuit than Desmond Tutu was.

One of the reasons why I think he's amazing. He's not an armchair philosopher. He's participated in the publishing process dozens, if not hundreds of times, and he still spends most of his time traveling and getting out there.

by **Rob** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 1:05 pm

Just put your head out the window and shout "Looking for a guest lecturer!"

Cornel West will show up at your front door in 10 minutes, guaranteed. He's more ubiquitous on the lecture/talk show circuit than Desmond Tutu was.

by **kirk** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 12:53 pm

Sears wrote:I've met both Malcolm Gladwell and Bill Bryson. Chill dudes.

[img]http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/new ... 79.png[img]

Not Nelly nor jelly. I wouldn't care a WHOLE lot about meeting scientists or empirical thinkers, despite me being a practitioner in empiricism and pursuing a career involving the scientific method. I'd much prefer to meet philosophers and those who have unbelievable wisdom. I had a professor who is probably one of the most thought-provoking and interesting people I will ever come across in my life. He taught theology and philosophy. Unbelievable man. Just the kind of people who I gravitate towards when trying to enlighten myself.

I've decided that, out of all human beings who have ever lived and are currently living, Cornel West may be my #1 choice for people I'd love to have a conversation with.

Or according to Joey when asking who Cornel West is, "who is that crazy black dude in this Youtube video?"

by **Sears** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 1:16 am

I've met both Malcolm Gladwell and Bill Bryson. Chill dudes.

by **kirk** » Fri Jan 27, 2012 12:23 am

Similarly high on my list of to-be-read books:

by **Swiss** » Thu Jan 26, 2012 7:33 pm

blink and outliers are both great books, love his writing style. its very conversational but interesting

by **kirk** » Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:54 pm

showtime wrote:[img]http://images.indiebound.com/930/017/97 ... 30.jpg[img]

Anything by Malcolm Gladwell is good

My girlfriend recently read Blink and had good things to say about it.

by **showtime** » Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:24 am

Anything by Malcolm Gladwell is good

by **seaNsk** » Wed Jan 25, 2012 1:17 am

joeledmunds wrote:SPOILERS

He does go in the basement, but it all works out in the end.

You just ruined the last few chapters for me.
I CANT BELIEVE YOU JOEL. FOR SHAME.

by **joeledmunds** » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:21 pm

SPOILERS

He does go in the basement, but it all works out in the end.

by **seaNsk** » Tue Jan 24, 2012 9:38 am

This shit is getting intense. I'm almost done with it!

by **fAn** » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:56 am

and

by **fAn** » Tue Jan 24, 2012 1:52 am

fghtffyrdmns wrote:

and

What are you... still in highschool?

by **Swiss** » Sun Jan 22, 2012 10:38 am

sevEN wrote:this book applys greatly to personal/romantic relationships and also your professional careers.

now i see what youve been doing in the office everyday

by **sevEN** » Sun Jan 22, 2012 10:33 am

lol seriously though, a few of the books i've read in the past year that have been pretty good (i don't really read THAT many books.. just ones that catch my eye)

Led an incredibly interesting life.. if you do ANY form of gambling or sports betting... i would highly recommend this book.

There is a version of this book called "The Denma Translation" which ive also read that has a lot of commentary and translations into more practical every day uses of this book because the book uses a lot of war lingo.. but even w/o the denma translations there is a lot to be taken from this book.

More psychology than philosophy alex, but still a very great read. i dont use it to manipulate people really, but more so to just be aware of what other people try to do.

don't let the title fool you... this book is more about finding true happiness within ourselves through buddhist beliefs.

this one is awesome too, especially if you're into psychology and philosophy. pretty ruthless and conniving at times, so take the "rules" in this book with a grain of salt.. some are very very easily applied to every day life, but a few are just pretty damn harsh and not what i believe in. either way, this is how a lot of people out in the real world think and will act towards you, so its good to read about it so that you're prepared. this book applys greatly to personal/romantic relationships and also your professional careers.

by **sevEN** » Sun Jan 22, 2012 10:15 am

lulz

by **Rob** » Sun Jan 22, 2012 9:52 am

Saw some people throwing around sci-fi writers so I figured I'd throw my personal fav into the lot:

by **`NG** » Sun Jan 22, 2012 1:19 am

too tired to search for covers right now.

Ragtime- E.L. Doctorow
Eden Express- Mark Vonnegut

by **warchyldd** » Sun Jan 22, 2012 12:55 am

by **Swiss** » Sat Jan 21, 2012 11:36 pm

in between. one of my favorite books

by **james-** » Sat Jan 21, 2012 10:34 pm

I didn't need to play the JFK speech to know which one it was

apparently I can't rep you without spreading rep to other users?

Anyways, in the terms of non-fiction I've been intermittently reading "The Rights of Man" and rereading Ambrose's "Wild Blue" I had read it in middle school and really enjoyed it, it's just as good a second time around.

I haven't read much in the way of enjoyable fiction lately. But if there is one work of fiction that I would recommend, it would have to be Garth Stein's "The Art of Racing in the Rain"
I read this book on a flight back from Europe, and couldn't put it down, I didn't even bother with sleep. If you love your dog, read this book.

by **gwolf_** » Sat Jan 21, 2012 8:14 pm

is good if you like history

by **lolinus** » Sat Jan 21, 2012 4:07 pm

I really like historical books, and Ken Follet is problably one of my favorite authors. If you're interested in history then check out his books.
Oh and also Conn Iggulden's books are awesome.

by **fghtffyrdmns** » Sat Jan 21, 2012 3:47 pm

and

by **Swiss** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 6:23 pm

by **mg_** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 4:25 pm

I think The Three Stigmata is pretty good. It's unlike any fiction I've really ever read. Normally when you think of non-developed characters it is because the author sucks. This is quite the opposite.

by **kirk** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 3:55 pm

mg_ wrote:Well, just read it. It is fiction, it won't be like that. It's only like a 135 pages or so.

Blade Runner is based on Dick's novel "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?" A lot of it has to do with reality, perception, real, fake, humanism, and quite a bit of existentialism/post-modern thought thrown in.

Which one should I look into first?

by **Sears** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 2:20 pm

by **mg_** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 2:18 pm

Well, just read it. It is fiction, it won't be like that. It's only like a 135 pages or so.

Blade Runner is based on Dick's novel "Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep?" A lot of it has to do with reality, perception, real, fake, humanism, and quite a bit of existentialism/post-modern thought thrown in.

by **kirk** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 2:14 pm

mg_ wrote:You might like Philip K. Dick, he's a sci fi fantasy author, but it is heavy on the philosophy. He's pretty much the patriarch of legitimate sci fi fiction. The general rule in English is skip Huxley and read Dick. None of his characters are developed which is really interesting. You don't care for them at all, it's all about the other stuff really.

The Ask is just modern dark comedy. It was okay. Sam Lipsyte's Home Land is top 5 books of all time for me. I'd give it a 6.5 out of 10.

Bingham is a former Law Lord in the U.K. He does a fairly interesting and basic discussion into the concept behind the Rule of Law. It draws heavily on Raz.

The Castle of Otranto is like the pinnacle gothic horror novel. The writing style is somewhat hard to follow, but interesting nonetheless.

What kind of philosophical concepts come up, exactly? The books I'm reading are almost more essay-esque. Not really dancing around it; very blunt. "Here are the philosophical concepts we're going to be talking about," sort of stuff.

by **ThatsRight** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 2:12 pm

moosh wrote:Just finished:

I did not want it to end, but read it in days. Decided to re-visit a book i haven't read in a decade:

[youtube]utYcFf93Srs&feature=related[/youtube]

and the shining is fantastic. The scene where he first flips out on his wife about being busy and not "bothering him" is one of the creepiest movie scenes of all-time.

by **ThatsRight** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:40 pm

I'm not "currently" reading it, but my favorite book I've ever read was The Last Lecture by Randy Pausch many months ago.

On September 18, 2007, computer science professor Randy Pausch stepped in front of an audience of 400 people at Carnegie Mellon University to deliver a last lecture called “Really Achieving Your Childhood Dreams.” With slides of his CT scans beaming out to the audience, Randy told his audience about the cancer that is devouring his pancreas and that will claim his life in a matter of months. On the stage that day, Randy was youthful, energetic, handsome, often cheerfully, darkly funny. He seemed invincible. But this was a brief moment, as he himself acknowledged.

Randy’s lecture has become a phenomenon, as has the book he wrote based on the same principles, celebrating the dreams we all strive to make realities. Sadly, Randy lost his battle to pancreatic cancer on July 25th, 2008, but his legacy will continue to inspire us all, for generations to come.

by **mg_** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:38 pm

You might like Philip K. Dick, he's a sci fi fantasy author, but it is heavy on the philosophy. He's pretty much the patriarch of legitimate sci fi fiction. The general rule in English is skip Huxley and read Dick. None of his characters are developed which is really interesting. You don't care for them at all, it's all about the other stuff really.

The Ask is just modern dark comedy. It was okay. Sam Lipsyte's Home Land is top 5 books of all time for me. I'd give it a 6.5 out of 10.

Bingham is a former Law Lord in the U.K. He does a fairly interesting and basic discussion into the concept behind the Rule of Law. It draws heavily on Raz.

The Castle of Otranto is like the pinnacle gothic horror novel. The writing style is somewhat hard to follow, but interesting nonetheless.

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