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by **cassinoroyale** » Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:50 am

Henry wrote:
sevEN wrote:
Henry wrote:I don't know why people are even comparing LeBron with MJ.

LeBron plays COMPLETELY different and controls the game in a different way. Michael Jordan was a devastating scorer who found ways to light you up, and since he was such a threat, it opened up the game for his role players once he learned to trust them. LeBron essentially is more of an all around guy a la Magic who controls the game by having the entire offensive system ran through him because he was that insanely well rounded.

I think the MJ/Kobe comparisons are more valid since they play a little similar (although we all know who wins that debate!)
very very good post. but we argue it because it's the internet and it's fun to debate certain topics. and this one always gets good.

and agreed on the MJ/kobe comparisons, if you are trying to compare apples to apples. but i still put lebron ahead of kobe overall
Yeah I agree I'd put LeBron over Kobe. Kobe has always been incredibly stubborn throughout his career and has not had any success unless he has had a premier big man along side of him to share the load. LeBron on the other hand has taken sacks of used diapers to the playoffs during his Cleveland days.

Then again, I'm still salty as fuck Kobe dropped 81 on the Raptors.....

An appropriate word for the level of throat-choking in this thread!

by **Henry** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 8:12 pm

sevEN wrote:
Henry wrote:I don't know why people are even comparing LeBron with MJ.

LeBron plays COMPLETELY different and controls the game in a different way. Michael Jordan was a devastating scorer who found ways to light you up, and since he was such a threat, it opened up the game for his role players once he learned to trust them. LeBron essentially is more of an all around guy a la Magic who controls the game by having the entire offensive system ran through him because he was that insanely well rounded.

I think the MJ/Kobe comparisons are more valid since they play a little similar (although we all know who wins that debate!)
very very good post. but we argue it because it's the internet and it's fun to debate certain topics. and this one always gets good.

and agreed on the MJ/kobe comparisons, if you are trying to compare apples to apples. but i still put lebron ahead of kobe overall

Yeah I agree I'd put LeBron over Kobe. Kobe has always been incredibly stubborn throughout his career and has not had any success unless he has had a premier big man along side of him to share the load. LeBron on the other hand has taken sacks of used diapers to the playoffs during his Cleveland days.

Then again, I'm still salty as fuck Kobe dropped 81 on the Raptors.....

by **tenks** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 6:49 pm

look at airnick chime in when the conversation was over and no one cares (well except joseph). lol

trololololed. hahahha

by **sevEN** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 1:00 pm

Airnick15 wrote:
tenks wrote: MJ didn't join hall of fame teamates or all-stars, he MADE them. Scottie Pippen was a great player don't get me wrong, but you think he would have had the same career he did w/o Jordann, yea that's fine, but the key difference is Jordan created those hall of famers, where as Lebron just made his worse.
From Wikipedia..."Michael Jordan retired before the 1993-94 season, and in his absence Pippen emerged from Jordan's shadow. That year, he earned All-Star Game MVP honors and led the Bulls in scoring, assists, and blocks, and was second in the NBA in steals per game, averaging 22.0 points, 8.7 rebounds, 5.6 assists, 2.9 steals, and 0.8 blocks per game, while shooting 49.1% from the field and a career-best 32% from the 3-point line. For his efforts, he earned the first of three straight All-NBA First Team selections, and he finished third in MVP voting. The Bulls finished the season with 55 wins, only two fewer than the year before. Pippen finished the 1994–95 season leading the Bulls in every major statistical category—points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks—becoming only the second player in NBA history to accomplish this."

STRONG this.

Airnick15 wrote:I don't see how you can say Lebron made his teammates worse with a straight face.

neither can i airnick....

Airnick15 wrote:I've never been "team Lebron", but some of the points you are making are absurd. Also, are you willing say that Lebron is already the most diversely talented player in NBA history, with the best combination of size, athleticism, and intelligence we have seen?

thank you very much.

by **sevEN** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 12:57 pm

by **milo** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 12:54 pm

joeledmunds wrote:
tenks wrote:
milo wrote:F6jKKVwqRug

eQMgbhQDcIE
YcIPXJa6Hc0

jrfD-d7XLLw

by **joeledmunds** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 6:13 am

tenks wrote:
milo wrote:F6jKKVwqRug

eQMgbhQDcIE

YcIPXJa6Hc0

by **Airnick15** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 6:02 am

Airnick15 wrote:
tenks wrote: MJ didn't join hall of fame teamates or all-stars, he MADE them. Scottie Pippen was a great player don't get me wrong, but you think he would have had the same career he did w/o Jordann, yea that's fine, but the key difference is Jordan created those hall of famers, where as Lebron just made his worse.
From Wikipedia..."Michael Jordan retired before the 1993-94 season, and in his absence Pippen emerged from Jordan's shadow. That year, he earned All-Star Game MVP honors and led the Bulls in scoring, assists, and blocks, and was second in the NBA in steals per game, averaging 22.0 points, 8.7 rebounds, 5.6 assists, 2.9 steals, and 0.8 blocks per game, while shooting 49.1% from the field and a career-best 32% from the 3-point line. For his efforts, he earned the first of three straight All-NBA First Team selections, and he finished third in MVP voting. The Bulls finished the season with 55 wins, only two fewer than the year before. Pippen finished the 1994–95 season leading the Bulls in every major statistical category—points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks—becoming only the second player in NBA history to accomplish this."

Those are hall of fame numbers without MJ for basically 2 seasons. I don't see how you can say Lebron made his teammates worse with a straight face. That never happened in Cleveland as he carried a team to the NBA Finals that shouldn't have even made it that far. By the way, he dropped 25 straight to go up 3-2 against Detroit in the ECF that year. Who is he "making worse" on the Heat? Certainly none of the role players are made worse by him, as they have the flexibility to put Lebron on the floor with a bunch of shooters and just let him create for them. Dwyane Wade? Not sure if his injuries or taking games off is responsible his uneven play, but this has caused Lebron has had to do more so they can win. Bosh? I would say that the design of the team and him trying to fit the role are most to blame for why he can look so pedestrian, as he has basically been assigned the role of being a PF who takes long jumpers only, so as to keep the lane open for LBJ and Wade. Bosh in Toronto thrived because he was able to mix in some post moves with his elite jumpshooting ability for a player of his size, whereas now he isn't afforded that luxury. I've never been "team Lebron", but some of the points you are making are absurd.

by **Airnick15** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 6:01 am

tenks wrote: MJ didn't join hall of fame teamates or all-stars, he MADE them. Scottie Pippen was a great player don't get me wrong, but you think he would have had the same career he did w/o Jordann, yea that's fine, but the key difference is Jordan created those hall of famers, where as Lebron just made his worse.

From Wikipedia..."Michael Jordan retired before the 1993-94 season, and in his absence Pippen emerged from Jordan's shadow. That year, he earned All-Star Game MVP honors and led the Bulls in scoring, assists, and blocks, and was second in the NBA in steals per game, averaging 22.0 points, 8.7 rebounds, 5.6 assists, 2.9 steals, and 0.8 blocks per game, while shooting 49.1% from the field and a career-best 32% from the 3-point line. For his efforts, he earned the first of three straight All-NBA First Team selections, and he finished third in MVP voting. The Bulls finished the season with 55 wins, only two fewer than the year before. Pippen finished the 1994–95 season leading the Bulls in every major statistical category—points, rebounds, assists, steals, and blocks—becoming only the second player in NBA history to accomplish this."

Those are hall of fame numbers without MJ for basically 2 seasons. I don't see how you can say Lebron made his teammates worse with a straight face. That never happened in Cleveland as he carried a team to the NBA Finals that shouldn't have even made it that far. By the way, he dropped 25 straight to go up 3-2 against Detroit in the ECF that year. Who is he "making worse" on the Heat? Certainly none of the role players are made worse by him, as they have the flexibility to put Lebron on the floor with a bunch of shooters and just let him create for them. Dwyane Wade? Not sure if his injuries or taking games off is responsible his uneven play, but this has caused Lebron has had to do more so they can win. Bosh? I would say that the design of the team and him trying to fit the role are most to blame for why he can look so pedestrian, as he has basically been assigned the role of being a PF who takes long jumpers only, so as to keep the lane open for LBJ and Wade. Bosh in Toronto thrived because he was able to mix in some post moves with his elite jumpshooting ability for a player of his size, whereas now he isn't afforded that luxury. I've never been "team Lebron", but some of the points you are making are absurd. Also, are you willing say that Lebron is already the most diversely talented player in NBA history, with the best combination of size, athleticism, and intelligence we have seen?

by **Airnick15** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 5:48 am

sevEN wrote: and the rings... great one. the ultimate team accomplishment being used to compare one player to another. but lebron is a 3rd of the way there to catching jordan anyways and he has 7-9 years of elite basketball to do it. the whole rings argument may only be valid for another 6-7 years so use it up while you can bro!!! Time is running out!

7-9 years of "elite" basketball seems high, especially if you are basing it off of what he does today.

by **lolinus** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 1:17 am

MJ was in the movie "Space Jam", his association with "Bugs Bunny" wins this discussion. He also defeated aliens in a match.

LeBron can't compete with that.

by **tenks** » Mon Jun 24, 2013 12:52 am

milo wrote:F6jKKVwqRug

eQMgbhQDcIE

by **sevEN** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:34 pm

Henry wrote:I don't know why people are even comparing LeBron with MJ.

LeBron plays COMPLETELY different and controls the game in a different way. Michael Jordan was a devastating scorer who found ways to light you up, and since he was such a threat, it opened up the game for his role players once he learned to trust them. LeBron essentially is more of an all around guy a la Magic who controls the game by having the entire offensive system ran through him because he was that insanely well rounded.

I think the MJ/Kobe comparisons are more valid since they play a little similar (although we all know who wins that debate!)

very very good post. but we argue it because it's the internet and it's fun to debate certain topics. and this one always gets good.

and agreed on the MJ/kobe comparisons, if you are trying to compare apples to apples. but i still put lebron ahead of kobe overall

by **tenks** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 10:03 pm

Henry wrote:
I think the MJ/Kobe comparisons are more valid since they play a little similar (although we all know who wins that debate!)

I agree completely.

by **Henry** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 7:46 pm

I don't know why people are even comparing LeBron with MJ.

LeBron plays COMPLETELY different and controls the game in a different way. Michael Jordan was a devastating scorer who found ways to light you up, and since he was such a threat, it opened up the game for his role players once he learned to trust them. LeBron essentially is more of an all around guy a la Magic who controls the game by having the entire offensive system ran through him because he was that insanely well rounded.

I think the MJ/Kobe comparisons are more valid since they play a little similar (although we all know who wins that debate!)

by **joeledmunds** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 7:04 pm

knockout wrote:different eras, different positions, different team comps, different offensive systems, different opponents. stupid argument every time it comes up.

all three are great players. they're all lumped into the greatest of all time group with other legends such as the birds/magics/kareems/oscars/russells/wests/etc. just watch them play awesome basketball and appreciate it for what it is! we all have favorites

Well, that's the most enlightened sports perspective I've ever seen.

by **tenks** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 6:57 pm

Miller` wrote:
tenks wrote:
Miller` wrote:. Jerk pulled an Elway with the 16th pick.
whats this about?
When Kobe was picked in the NBA draft at the 13th pick (googled since previous post), he (coming out of high school) refused to sign with the Charlotte Hornets because they were not a big enough market for him. So they had to trade him to LA for Vlade Divac. As a NC native, I have found him to be a pompous prick ever since.

ahh ok the elway comment makes waay more sense now, haha.

Kobe and MJ both ran the same offense, so they're the most directly comparable I think, same with their similar insane crazy drive. I personally think Lebron is better than Kobe, but it will be interesting to see how the two compare when he's done, as far as mileage wise. They both came out of HS so they will have a similiar length of career in the nba (assuming lebron plays until his late 30s). Kobe's still super competitive for his age, we'll see how Lebron ages.

by **knockout** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 5:41 pm

different eras, different positions, different team comps, different offensive systems, different opponents. stupid argument every time it comes up.

all three are great players. they're all lumped into the greatest of all time group with other legends such as the birds/magics/kareems/oscars/russells/wests/etc. just watch them play awesome basketball and appreciate it for what it is! we all have favorites

by **sevEN** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 4:54 pm

Miller` wrote:
tenks wrote:
Miller` wrote:. Jerk pulled an Elway with the 16th pick.
whats this about?
When Kobe was picked in the NBA draft at the 13th pick (googled since previous post), he (coming out of high school) refused to sign with the Charlotte Hornets because they were not a big enough market for him. So they had to trade him to LA for Vlade Divac. As a NC native, I have found him to be a pompous prick ever since.

totally agree miller. kobe is a scum bag. and a rapist. and the most selfish player ive ever seen

by **sevEN** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 4:51 pm

TonyMontana wrote:Look at it this way, there are LOTS of players on Lebrons level right now.

not only is that comment not true, but your emphasis on the word LOTS with capitals is even more absurd. there are MAYBE 2-3 players that can be considered near the conversation. other than that, lebron has a strangle hold on the top spot among NBA players.

TonyMontana wrote:In Micheals time, aside from maybe magic, NOBODY was even CLOSE to his level.

once again, not only do i find your comment hilarious, but the emphasis on certain words makes it even more ridiculous. if you think magic was the only player on jordan's level, yet magic himself has admitted to larry bird being the best player he has ever competed against, how can you STRESS THE FACT WITH CAPITALS that "NOBODY was even CLOSE" to his level?

[quote=""TonyMontana"]Micheal will always be the better basketball player anyone who thinks otherwise is just a little crazy.[/quote]

this kind of blind kool-aid drinking logic is what i am talking about. for you to make that statement before lebron has had a chance to finish his career is stupid. just crowning jordan the best that ever was and ever will be by default is what pisses me off. so many ppl just give it to him by default. it has been ingrained in our culture. people who dont know shit about basketball somehow seem to know that jordan is the best ever. he is too big for basketball and his legend extends far beyond the basketball court which is why we live in a world where jordan is blindly auto-crowned the best ever without a single thought.

and lastly...

TonyMontana wrote:Jordan already DID his career

really? Jordan DID his career already? strong english is strong

by **Shoolta** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 4:37 pm

LJ will never do what jordan achievement and MJ will never do what Lebron achievement.. the question here is that at this time lebron james is the best player in the nba! and was the one who gave the championship to miami heat..
Jordan is history, lebron is future! and they lived happily ever after (?

by **Miller`** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:02 pm

tenks wrote:
Miller` wrote:. Jerk pulled an Elway with the 16th pick.
whats this about?

When Kobe was picked in the NBA draft at the 13th pick (googled since previous post), he (coming out of high school) refused to sign with the Charlotte Hornets because they were not a big enough market for him. So they had to trade him to LA for Vlade Divac. As a NC native, I have found him to be a pompous prick ever since.

by **tenks** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:57 pm

Miller` wrote:. Jerk pulled an Elway with the 16th pick.

whats this about?

by **Miller`** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 4:51 am

By the way, the real answer is that there is no comparison until Lebron's career is over. I'm just happy the same argument with Kobe is now over. Jerk pulled an Elway with the 16th pick.

by **Miller`** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 4:42 am

sevEN wrote:

i bet lebron would make a better owner too lulz

umad?

Is that MJ? Shit, I thought it was Lawrence Taylor.

by **tenks** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:13 am

6Jq3LuMq6D0

by **milo** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:10 am

F6jKKVwqRug

by **tenks** » Sun Jun 23, 2013 12:03 am

Why would I be mad? Lol, I like Lebron and the Heat

I know this is old, but I just saw it for the first time. Did a pretty good job actually.

Ir2TdfSwH8g

Can you find DWAde and Battier?

I can :O

by **sevEN** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:54 pm

i bet lebron would make a better owner too lulz

umad?

by **sevEN** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:52 pm

lmfao, epic gif. haters gonna hate

by **tenks** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:50 pm

by **sevEN** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:48 pm

i've retracted one.... the hell are you talking about. and it wasnt a stupid statement. i project lebron to have a body of work both talent wise and accomplishment wise that will be in the same conversation as jordan at the very least, and in my opinion, better. i took back my comment about saying it right now pre-maturely, that's all

by **tenks** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:45 pm

Not a single comment was edited but you can retract your stupid statements?

ROFL, this is too much.

by **sevEN** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:44 pm

tenks wrote:
sevEN wrote: ESPECIALLY since lebron joined up with wade during wade's decline and bosh has been outright bad at times during his 3 years with the heat. .
but I thought Lebron was making his team better? How are Wade and Bosh playing worse? Which is it Joey?

Walking Contradiction in action~

lol...

me saying "bosh has been bad at times" does not equal me saying "lebron makes his team worse"

me saying "lebron joined wade during the decline of his career" does not equal me saying "lebron makes his team worse"

i am so confused as to how you keep coming to these conclusions on what i have said when it is all here for you to read and re-read. not a single comment has been edited. are we reading the same shit?!??

by **tenks** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:35 pm

sevEN wrote:i didnt use the "lebron too" argument except for the part where you literally described everything that makes lebron great, while describing jordan.

*Cough* *Cough*

sevEN wrote:
TonyMontana wrote:-Micheal never left Chicago to play with magic and the Lakers
-Micheal won 6 championships and never once bragged that he was gonna do it prior.
MJ was probably the cockiest player in history. i am 100% sure he proclaimed he would win titles at some point.

sevEN wrote:lebron won his first ring at 28. how old was jordan when he won his first ring? 28.

sevEN wrote:i just find it funny that more than half the stuff ppl use to bash lebron, jordan was guilty of the same shit. and lebron was handed a team? MJ had hall of famers ALL AROUND HIM THE ENTIRE TIME. .

And *cough*

sevEN wrote: ESPECIALLY since lebron joined up with wade during wade's decline and bosh has been outright bad at times during his 3 years with the heat. .

but I thought Lebron was making his team better? How are Wade and Bosh playing worse? Which is it Joey?

Walking Contradiction in action~

by **sevEN** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:24 pm

tenks wrote:Everytime anyone makes a valid point about Jordan, you say "Lebron too!" and Whenever someone makes a negative point about Lebron you say "jordan did too!" - that's all you got.

You are a walking contradiction joey. First Lebron makes his team worse, now he makes it better? Which is it man? Discussing anything sports related with you is pointless.

anyone here can read every comment on this thread and tell you your first comment is just not true.

secondly, i never once said lebron made his team worse... are you kidding?

and i didnt use the "lebron too" argument except for the part where you literally described everything that makes lebron great, while describing jordan.

you're just a homer.

by **tenks** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 11:18 pm

Everytime anyone makes a valid point about Jordan, you say "yea Lebron did that too!" and whenever someone makes a negative point about Lebron you say "Yea Jordan did that too!" - that's all you got. You took my entire post, which went over your head, and just said no that's Lebron not Jordan, duh!

You are a walking contradiction joey. First Lebron makes his team worse, now he makes it better? Which is it man? Discussing anything sports related with you is pointless.

by **joeledmunds** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 6:04 pm

Hudson` wrote:

by **Hudson`** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 6:02 pm

THIS THREAD IS NOW ABOUT BASEBALL PLAYERS DANCING

by **sevEN** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 5:47 pm

tenks wrote:
sevEN wrote: i will not say lebron is the greatest ever since he hasn't finished his career.

sevEN wrote:
Lebron is the best player in NBA history

bro, this is the 8th time i have to tell you this to get it through your head of yours. the second quote you listed has been RETRACTED since it was posted. yet you keep basing your posts off of that one comment. i have since taken it back and admitted that while i feel like he will be arguably just as good or better than MJ when all is said and done, i cannot make that statement right now with so much of lebron's career to go. so keep hanging on to that one comment if you want to...

tenks wrote: Here is why this is a bad argument. Dwayne Wade was ALREADY good before Lebron joined, Chris Bosh was ALREADY good before he joined Lebron. Lebron didn't make them better, in fact quite the opposite. You said it yourself, DWade and Bosh are playing worse with Lebron. Lebron sought out and joined up with already proven all-stars.

lebron doesnt make hi steam better? ARe you kidding me? All he does is draw double and tripple coverage and give shooters WIDE open looks. do you think battier hits 6 three pointers and 8 three pointers respectively in 2 straight championship close out games without lebron drawing 4 defenders into the paint? Or mike miller? Do you think a guy who has over 8 assists a game in his playoff career isnt creating shots for his teamates? for you to say he isnt making his team better is absurd and an argument i feel dumber for even acknowledging.

tenks wrote: MJ didn't join hall of fame teamates or all-stars, he MADE them. Scottie Pippen was a great player don't get me wrong, but you think he would have had the same career he did w/o Jordan? Same with any of the role players he had over the years. John Paxon, Steve Kerr, Horrace Grant, the list goes on. All of those players played for different teams in their career before and after their years with the Bulls(Jordan)...And all those players had no where near the numbers they did when they played with the Bulls(Jordan). They got more open and scored more points on the Bulls then they did with any other team because everyone was worried about Jordan. They got more assists on the Bulls then they did with any other team because they were passing to Jordan...The only exception to this is Rodman, he was a beast on Pistons and Spurs long before he joined the Bulls. But once again if you look at his stats, it shows his scoring and assists increased when he played with the Bulls(Jordan)...Surprise.

you literally just described lebron's career with the heat, except you subbed lebron's name with jordan and the other heat role players with bulls role players names. nice job bro. somehow if you put jordan's name in it, he makes his team better but lebron doesnt? and lol, are you trying to use a capital MADE when describing how jordan MADE pippen?? do you think pippen was voted to 10 all defensive-defensive teams during his career? (two of those 10 being with the trail blazers and rockets, which were without jordan...) do you think he lead the league in steals because of what jordan did? this argument is yet another jordan kool-aid story. pippen was a hall of fame player in his own right, separate from anyone else. it is just selective logic when you try to discredit jordan's surrounding talent because he MADE THEM, but lebron gets knocked because he is playing with SUCH AMAZING SUPERSTARZZ!!!!

tenks wrote: I think my point is obvious here without going on much further. Jordan was surrounded by hall of famers like Lebron, yea that's fine, but the key difference is Jordan created those hall of famers, where as Lebron just made his worse.

lolz... i count 1 single hall of famer that has crossed paths with lebron since joining the heat. and that is wade. i can name at least 4 that are already in or have strong consideration to be in. and how on earth does lebron "make his worse" ?? if you are blaming dwayne wade's knee injuries and bosh's softness in the paint on lebron, then...... once again man you are just saying shit at this point. none of it really holding any merit.

and the rings... great one. the ultimate team accomplishment being used to compare one player to another. but lebron is a 3rd of the way there to catching jordan anyways and he has 7-9 years of elite basketball to do it. the whole rings argument may only be valid for another 6-7 years so use it up while you can bro!!! Time is running out!

by **tenks** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 1:25 am

All messing aside Joey, there is just one counter-point/argument that Lebron fans always use and it's just strait wrong and I'm not just picking on you..I hear it from everyone.

So the statement is made that Lebron was handed a team and his championships were bought and manufactured. (I'm not saying this, this is just a popular argument).

Then Lebron fans retort, like you, that MJ was surrounded by hall of famers too, so its a moot point.

Here is why this is a bad argument. Dwayne Wade was ALREADY good before Lebron joined, Chris Bosh was ALREADY good before he joined Lebron. Lebron didn't make them better, in fact quite the opposite. You said it yourself, DWade and Bosh are playing worse with Lebron. Lebron sought out and joined up with already proven all-stars.

MJ didn't join hall of fame teamates or all-stars, he MADE them. Scottie Pippen was a great player don't get me wrong, but you think he would have had the same career he did w/o Jordan? Same with any of the role players he had over the years. John Paxon, Steve Kerr, Horrace Grant, the list goes on. All of those players played for different teams in their career before and after their years with the Bulls(Jordan)...And all those players had no where near the numbers they did when they played with the Bulls(Jordan). They got more open and scored more points on the Bulls then they did with any other team because everyone was worried about Jordan. They got more assists on the Bulls then they did with any other team because they were passing to Jordan...The only exception to this is Rodman, he was a beast on Pistons and Spurs long before he joined the Bulls. But once again if you look at his stats, it shows his scoring and assists increased when he played with the Bulls(Jordan)...Surprise.

I think my point is obvious here without going on much further. Jordan was surrounded by hall of famers like Lebron, yea that's fine, but the key difference is Jordan created those hall of famers, where as Lebron just made his worse.

And its not that people can't fathom others being as great or greater than Jordan, it's the things that Jordan did that cannot be measured is why he is the greatest, something that Kirk touched on nicely.

oh and this..

by **tenks** » Sat Jun 22, 2013 1:04 am

sevEN wrote: i will not say lebron is the greatest ever since he hasn't finished his career.

sevEN wrote:
Lebron is the best player in NBA history

by **sevEN** » Fri Jun 21, 2013 11:51 pm

kirk wrote:
sevEN wrote:jason, your weak attempt to insult me was over a point that i had retracted since you made your post. and everyone has their own opinions and everyone values different things when judging a player and his greatness. i could go on for days typing responses to everyone but i wont. i just find it funny that more than half the stuff ppl use to bash lebron, jordan was guilty of the same shit. and lebron was handed a team? MJ had hall of famers ALL AROUND HIM THE ENTIRE TIME. you all act like jordan single handedly won 6 rings. who was coaching him? top 3 coach of all time... and who did he have around him? i'd take pippen and rodman over wade/bosh any day that ends in a Y. ESPECIALLY since lebron joined up with wade during wade's decline and bosh has been outright bad at times during his 3 years with the heat. and sean, everything you said in your post is not even close to the truth about lebron in recent years. that has been the exact broken record that all the blind lebron haters have been saying for years and you dont watch enough basketball to understand that what you're saying is so wrong.

sorry to all the butt hurt jordan kool-aid drinkers. once again, i will not say lebron is the greatest ever since he hasn't finished his career. but i'll be standing here in 10 years saying i told you so.
If you are lumping me in with these so-called Jordan Kool-Aid drinkers then I am going to ban you from my life. I feel like my post was not unreasonable.

not you at all. yours were very reasonable. that was more of a general statement. jordan has just been ingrained in our culture as the undisputed, unquestioned, and undeniable best player ever without any takers. and ppl won't ever stop to fathom the idea that anyone could be half as good as he was. i think there are certain players that are closer than anyone gives them credit for

by **kirk** » Fri Jun 21, 2013 10:00 pm

sevEN wrote:jason, your weak attempt to insult me was over a point that i had retracted since you made your post. and everyone has their own opinions and everyone values different things when judging a player and his greatness. i could go on for days typing responses to everyone but i wont. i just find it funny that more than half the stuff ppl use to bash lebron, jordan was guilty of the same shit. and lebron was handed a team? MJ had hall of famers ALL AROUND HIM THE ENTIRE TIME. you all act like jordan single handedly won 6 rings. who was coaching him? top 3 coach of all time... and who did he have around him? i'd take pippen and rodman over wade/bosh any day that ends in a Y. ESPECIALLY since lebron joined up with wade during wade's decline and bosh has been outright bad at times during his 3 years with the heat. and sean, everything you said in your post is not even close to the truth about lebron in recent years. that has been the exact broken record that all the blind lebron haters have been saying for years and you dont watch enough basketball to understand that what you're saying is so wrong.

sorry to all the butt hurt jordan kool-aid drinkers. once again, i will not say lebron is the greatest ever since he hasn't finished his career. but i'll be standing here in 10 years saying i told you so.

If you are lumping me in with these so-called Jordan Kool-Aid drinkers then I am going to ban you from my life. I feel like my post was not unreasonable.

by **sevEN** » Fri Jun 21, 2013 7:13 pm

jason, your weak attempt to insult me was over a point that i had retracted since you made your post. and everyone has their own opinions and everyone values different things when judging a player and his greatness. i could go on for days typing responses to everyone but i wont. i just find it funny that more than half the stuff ppl use to bash lebron, jordan was guilty of the same shit. and lebron was handed a team? MJ had hall of famers ALL AROUND HIM THE ENTIRE TIME. you all act like jordan single handedly won 6 rings. who was coaching him? top 3 coach of all time... and who did he have around him? i'd take pippen and rodman over wade/bosh any day that ends in a Y. ESPECIALLY since lebron joined up with wade during wade's decline and bosh has been outright bad at times during his 3 years with the heat. and sean, everything you said in your post is not even close to the truth about lebron in recent years. that has been the exact broken record that all the blind lebron haters have been saying for years and you dont watch enough basketball to understand that what you're saying is so wrong.

sorry to all the butt hurt jordan kool-aid drinkers. once again, i will not say lebron is the greatest ever since he hasn't finished his career. but i'll be standing here in 10 years saying i told you so.

by **kirk** » Fri Jun 21, 2013 6:31 pm

jmny wrote:
kirk wrote:
jmny wrote:I don't like getting involved in the Jordan/Lebron debate, but, as a Lebron fan, this was the best response. In my opinion, you can't judge a career that's over vs. a career with several years to play. Jordan is a legend, Lebron is becoming/will be one. When it's over we can have this debate all day, and I'm pretty confident it will be Lebron.
GUESS YOU DIDN'T SEE MY RESPONSE BECAUSE I PRETTY MUCH SAID THIS EXACTLY.
I tend to skip over your posts. LOLATE~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`

Clans: not feature6

by **jmny** » Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:52 pm

kirk wrote:
jmny wrote:I don't like getting involved in the Jordan/Lebron debate, but, as a Lebron fan, this was the best response. In my opinion, you can't judge a career that's over vs. a career with several years to play. Jordan is a legend, Lebron is becoming/will be one. When it's over we can have this debate all day, and I'm pretty confident it will be Lebron.
GUESS YOU DIDN'T SEE MY RESPONSE BECAUSE I PRETTY MUCH SAID THIS EXACTLY.

I tend to skip over your posts. LOLATE~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~`

by **d u c k s** » Fri Jun 21, 2013 5:30 pm

Spurs Danny Green just chillen with LeBron & co. at the club after the game.

by **joeledmunds** » Fri Jun 21, 2013 4:32 pm

jmny wrote:In other news, one of my good friends works for ESPN radio down here and filmed this outside the Heat locker room last night: n8l_6jFZxjA

Haha yeah saw that earlier today. Pretty funny.

by **kirk** » Fri Jun 21, 2013 4:26 pm

jmny wrote:I don't like getting involved in the Jordan/Lebron debate, but, as a Lebron fan, this was the best response. In my opinion, you can't judge a career that's over vs. a career with several years to play. Jordan is a legend, Lebron is becoming/will be one. When it's over we can have this debate all day, and I'm pretty confident it will be Lebron.

GUESS YOU DIDN'T SEE MY RESPONSE BECAUSE I PRETTY MUCH SAID THIS EXACTLY.

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