Osama bin Laden down?

Airnick15 · Post by **Airnick15** » Mon May 02, 2011 4:05 pm

Sears wrote:Mitch is the only one making sense.

Sure, these are complex issues. Which is why you can't dumb them down to incredibly simplified ideologies (e.g. tea party), on either side of the isle.

IMO, we shouldn't be policing the world, but I also totally understand how we find ourselves in the position which we are (and you can't go backwards). I'm a pacifist by nature, but I also think that at times, while rare, violence is absolutely necessary, and warranted. We shouldn't spend near as much of our resources on defense, and people who make exponentially more money than 98% of the population should pay a pretty sizable chunk back to the society that made it possible for them to become so wealthy. We shouldn't be throwing keggers in front of the white house because we shot a mass murdering ass hole in the head. We are better than that, it's what makes us, not them.

Our government should be big, active in our daily lives, and at times, powerful. But, it should also be efficient, just, well-designed, accessible, and all-inclusive.

It's an incredibly complex world with incredibly complex challenges; social, economic, political, and cultural alike.

There are no simple, bumper sticker solutions.

I feel like I just watched the ending of the Springer show when shit gets serious and Jerry sums life up.

unpro · Post by **unpro** » Mon May 02, 2011 4:21 pm

im saying, keep your majority by 1% regulation out of my house. I see no reason the government should have any say on what we do or say outside of a judicial system upholding basic morals and ownership claims. there is no reason i shouldnt be allowed to smoke what i want in my own house legally. there is no reason i should not be able to drink any kind of alcohol i want in my house legally. there is no reason i shouldnt be able to view whatever i want on the internet without someones viewpoint based on a religious ideology taking that away. there is no reason i shouldnt be able to carry a gun with me at all times in any state(outside of bars and other places that sell open containers, and government buildings) there is no reason i should be getting a full body xray or a hugely invasive pat down just to fly on a privately owned aircraft. there is no reason we should be giving churches nonprofit tax breaks. that is the most for profit organization i can think of. there is no reason the police should be able to force me to wear a seatbelt(i agree, i think its dumb not to wear one.)

no reason gay marriage should be illegal
no reason abortion should be illegal.
it should not cost 10000 dollars just to run for a local elected office and a "party designation"
etc.

also, i dont consider the middleground in discussing politics, simply because the middleground is fleeting - the easiest swayed to a specific viewpoint if given a 'good' enough reason. pearl harbor is an excellent example. the vast majority of americans wanted nothing to do with the war, and we mildly supported efforts to supply europe or asia. the government itself wanted to do that, based on the assumption that it was in the best interest of the country without regard for the populations opinion. after pearl harbor virtually ALL the middle ground opposition disappeared overnight. i think however if the people of the country knew of the genocides hitler was committing, or the brutality of the japanese army in china we would be willing to help in a war. the truth is always missing from the equation in large government, and its hidden behind red tape you can never fully traverse.

a large government fears personal opinion, because personal opinion is the only thing that can truly stand against it. a large government fears truth, because a lie is what keeps it together.

Airnick15 · Post by **Airnick15** » Mon May 02, 2011 4:30 pm

"there is no reason i shouldnt be able to carry a gun with me at all times in any state(outside of bars and other places that sell open containers, and government buildings)"

Really? I could list all the reasons why that may be the worst idea ever, but I don't feel like sitting here for a day.

t`RavE · Post by **t`RavE** » Mon May 02, 2011 4:38 pm

unpro wrote:there is no reason i shouldnt be able to carry a gun with me at all times in any state(outside of bars and other places that sell open containers, and government buildings)

Who do you think would regulate this? The state or county police? People think that the world would be so awesome with little government, but just look at how that worked out with the stock market. It's funny that people complain about freedom and "big government" that would hold them back from being rich, and they fear socialism when 99% of our wealth is owned by the top 1%. "Oh, I want the opportunity to be a millionaire though!" Enjoy your fantasy land, few people actually achieve the so-called, "American Dream." Go ahead and wish for anarchy or little government, join the countless civil wars and genocides in Africa throughout the years.

kirk · Post by **kirk** » Mon May 02, 2011 4:53 pm

Brb moving to France where full time work is 30 hours per week and I have a mandatory 6 week vacation.

Have fun with your capitalism, losers! Muahahaha!

Not srs. (A little srs.)

unpro · Post by **unpro** » Mon May 02, 2011 4:59 pm

Airnick15 wrote:"there is no reason i shouldnt be able to carry a gun with me at all times in any state(outside of bars and other places that sell open containers, and government buildings)"

Really? I could list all the reasons why that may be the worst idea ever, but I don't feel like sitting here for a day.

arizona has complete open and concealed carry without a permit. you know we dont have regular shootings in our grocery stores right? its easy to regulate that.

also, the stock market is one of the most heavily regulated things in our country. the improper regulations on mortgage companies is what gave way to the housing market crash. forcing and making it so attractive to greedy companies looking to prop up there stock holders on risky loans is what enabled the crash to be so devastating.

Swiss · Post by **Swiss** » Mon May 02, 2011 5:00 pm

one of the funniest tie-ins ive ever seen espn attempt

Sears · Post by **Sears** » Mon May 02, 2011 5:10 pm

unpro wrote:arizona has complete open and concealed carry without a permit. you know we dont have regular shootings in our grocery stores right? its easy to regulate that.

Are you advocating for zero gun regulations, and using Arizona as an example for the legitimacy of such a policy?

Just trying to be clear cause I'm not sure I understand your meaning.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2011_Tucson_shooting

Airnick15 · Post by **Airnick15** » Mon May 02, 2011 5:11 pm

unpro wrote: arizona has complete open and concealed carry without a permit. you know we dont have regular shootings in our grocery stores right?

Arizona grocery store shooting? Hmm.....

Sears · Post by **Sears** » Mon May 02, 2011 5:14 pm

Airnick15 wrote:Arizona grocery store shooting? Hmm.....

james- · Post by **james-** » Mon May 02, 2011 7:03 pm

Okay so after hearing a few things through the day I'm a amazed by how terribly this whole thing has been handled.

They got rid of his body, and dumped it in the ocean within hours of him getting killed. That sounds fishy as fuck, I understand their desire to get rid of it quickly so that no "radicals" try to do something involving it. But this is stupid, someone with such a large profile, being dumped in the ocean before anyone knows about it? I know that they did 2 DNA tests and everything, but that still takes away any chance the public had to have a 3rd party go in and confirm the results for themselves.

I also over heard that the pictures had been released, so naturally I was excited to see it. I wanted to see if it all resembled him or if it was just some picture of a completely destroyed head. Well after a very short scroll down the first page of google results I find multiple stories showing that the picture is fake. After looking a bit more it seems like this is the work of an individual who didn't have any government connections.

What I do know is that the US government does have pictures of him but are debating on weather or not to release them because of the "graphic nature of the photo"
Another thing that just sounds stupid to me. This is America, remember how we paraded Sadam around when he got caught? Why are we going to be nice about this? Show that picture, let the nerds of the interweb decided if it's him or not.

I just find it hard to believe that we couldn't find an ex CIA operative for 10 years since he "masterminded" the 9/11 attacks, and once we do get him... we dump his body in the ocean before we let anyone know...

Maybe Tim Osman is dead, but I don't think any of us can know without a doubt.

Tin Foil hat comments are appreciated, but not required.

james- · Post by **james-** » Mon May 02, 2011 7:09 pm

unpro wrote:im saying, keep your majority by 1% regulation out of my house. I see no reason the government should have any say on what we do or say outside of a judicial system upholding basic morals and ownership claims. there is no reason i shouldnt be allowed to smoke what i want in my own house legally. there is no reason i should not be able to drink any kind of alcohol i want in my house legally. there is no reason i shouldnt be able to view whatever i want on the internet without someones viewpoint based on a religious ideology taking that away. there is no reason i shouldnt be able to carry a gun with me at all times in any state(outside of bars and other places that sell open containers, and government buildings) there is no reason i should be getting a full body xray or a hugely invasive pat down just to fly on a privately owned aircraft. there is no reason we should be giving churches nonprofit tax breaks. that is the most for profit organization i can think of. there is no reason the police should be able to force me to wear a seatbelt(i agree, i think its dumb not to wear one.)

no reason gay marriage should be illegal
no reason abortion should be illegal.
it should not cost 10000 dollars just to run for a local elected office and a "party designation"
etc.

also, i dont consider the middleground in discussing politics, simply because the middleground is fleeting - the easiest swayed to a specific viewpoint if given a 'good' enough reason. pearl harbor is an excellent example. the vast majority of americans wanted nothing to do with the war, and we mildly supported efforts to supply europe or asia. the government itself wanted to do that, based on the assumption that it was in the best interest of the country without regard for the populations opinion. after pearl harbor virtually ALL the middle ground opposition disappeared overnight. i think however if the people of the country knew of the genocides hitler was committing, or the brutality of the japanese army in china we would be willing to help in a war. the truth is always missing from the equation in large government, and its hidden behind red tape you can never fully traverse.

a large government fears personal opinion, because personal opinion is the only thing that can truly stand against it. a large government fears truth, because a lie is what keeps it together.

QFMotherfuckingT

Sears · Post by **Sears** » Mon May 02, 2011 7:14 pm

More like quoted for irrational, emotional rambling, but yeah.

I think I'm going to lock this thread, as this discussion has strayed far from the original topic, and more or less served as means for us to announce which end of the political (and crazy) spectrum we lie. Which is just unnecessary.

Moving along now.

1911 Beta

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